19:04:21 #startmeeting 19:04:21 Meeting started Wed Dec 1 19:04:21 2010 UTC. The chair is suseROCKs. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:04:21 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:04:23 suseROCKs: you see. we urgently need henne 19:04:32 #chair rhorstkoetter 19:04:32 Current chairs: rhorstkoetter suseROCKs 19:04:36 #chair prusnak 19:04:36 Current chairs: prusnak rhorstkoetter suseROCKs 19:05:16 #topic openSUSE Board Meeting 19:05:35 Alrighty so let's begin, folks! 19:06:07 Today's agenda will be: 19:06:10 1. openSUSE election / committee 19:06:10 2. openSUSE Foundation 19:06:10 3. Where do we need to improve ? 19:06:10 4. Questions & Answers 19:06:22 Do we have additional items we wish to add to the agenda? 19:07:14 not at this time 19:07:18 ok I'll take that as a no and move on to the first topic 19:07:37 #topic openSUSE Board Meeting | Topic: openSUSE election /committee 19:08:12 the commitee just announced the elections and we already have two candidates 19:08:14 So we have an announcement posted about the election committee and a timeline described in the post 19:08:54 Yes, I've talked to a few people already who are interested in running. Not sure if its the same people you're referring to 19:09:10 but whomever we have already talked to, we should be sure to poke them to submit their application pronto 19:09:15 if they haven't already done so 19:09:19 * mrdocs will stand as well 19:09:26 just not sent the mail 19:09:34 I'm referring to sebastian kügler (sebas) & chuck payne (terrorpup) 19:09:38 poke mrdocs :-) 19:09:55 lo suseROCKs 19:10:03 that are the emails I read on election-officials/opensuse-project so far 19:10:08 ok there's one more to that list. but until that person actually declares it publicly, I prefer to let it stand until he/she states so 19:10:48 so I would surmise from what I'm seeing here that we can rejoice that this year we will actually have an election! ;-) 19:11:45 As you have seen from our mailing list, I have a first draft of the board's perception of what it means to be on the board 19:11:57 I need to further re-draft it, and encourage you both to submit your comments as well 19:12:13 let's get it published no later than this week. Cool, guys? 19:12:57 ack 19:12:57 suseROCKs: will comment 19:13:17 haven't had the time yet. thanks for the initial draft 19:13:28 #action suseROCKs to publish the Board's Perspective on being a Board Member with comments from other board members by end of the week 19:13:31 Iirc henne wrote some comments already 19:13:41 yes 19:14:06 ok so, I take it the election committee is on the ball and we have generally no concerns at this point? 19:14:24 if so, let's close this topic. :-) 19:14:58 good 19:15:12 topic is closed... 19:15:31 #topic openSUSE Board Meeting | Topic openSUSE Foundation 19:15:53 afaik we have alan clark attending today 19:16:02 aclark_: ping 19:16:09 you sniffed me out ;-) 19:16:21 hey hey aclark_ ! 19:16:26 aclark_: welcome to our meeting and thanks for being here 19:16:39 thanks 19:16:53 before we proceed, I think the biggest question we need to address is how do we proceed henceforth on interfacing here? 19:17:16 previously, michl was doing all the work on that end, which was good in some ways and other ways not so good. It wasn't transparent enough for us. 19:17:49 so let's clear up how we communicate henceforth before we get into nitty gritty details with aclark_ :-) 19:18:07 most likely it has been too much 1 on 1 telecom :) 19:18:26 yes, and that left some of us out of the process 19:18:31 what about collaborating through board@o.o? 19:18:46 aclark_: would that be sufficient from your perspective? 19:18:56 I would prefer that as it gives us a nice paper trail. 19:19:04 +1 19:19:34 I'm fine with that plus henne and I have been using piratepad for docs. 19:19:45 i think you've all seen that? 19:19:52 except when piratepad goes down :-) 19:19:55 yes, it's at http://piratepad.net/openSUSE-Bylaws 19:20:23 we're currently drafting the bylaws there 19:20:29 right 19:20:38 aclark_: you're fine with that approach? 19:20:46 I guess so 19:21:07 +1 19:21:34 ok so we have established the communication channel clearly now and I think we're all comfortable with that 19:22:09 so... since we've all been in and out on this process lately. let's just quickly summarize where we are at and what we need to do in the next 2-3 steps 19:22:44 1. We are drafting bylaws 19:22:49 2. .... 19:23:41 The next step that I am working on is meeting with Novell Legal. I'm waiting in their queue. As you can imagine they have been consumed with a different matter 19:23:55 aclark_: obviously 19:24:05 I can't imagine what that other matter might be. :-) 19:24:40 The purpose is to review the current plans and open questions. 19:24:47 aclark_: once we have the bylaws in place and you handled the process with novell legal I may help implementing the bylaws 19:24:50 if appreciated 19:24:56 I guess we also have some questions as to where our direction (with Novell as a partner) might go on the Foundation. But that's the kind of question that cannot be answered at this time. 19:25:35 rhorstkoetter, You mean like taking care of filing, etc. in Germany? 19:25:48 suseROCKs: thing like that, yes 19:26:01 investigating what we need to do in that regard 19:27:10 might I suggest you go ahead and investigate those steps now rather than wait for the bylaws to be completed? Information on that is not wholly dependent on the final draft of the bylaws 19:27:11 I will suggest that to the legal team. 19:27:39 suseROCKs: fine by me 19:28:03 #action rhorstkoetter to investigate procedures for filing e.V. application in Germany 19:28:04 I have some thick books in my bookshelf for that ;) 19:28:45 What? You don't just go online and fill out a form that charges you $10,000 for a $25 process? :-) 19:29:02 nope 19:29:04 prusnak, any comments from you on the Foundation topic? 19:29:30 I read books and law papers 19:29:36 nothing in particular 19:29:39 old school approach 19:29:42 ;) 19:30:21 ok so, I think the final matter we should address is timeline? Do we have a deadline for completing our draft of the bylaws? 19:30:55 aclark_: you currently collaboarte with henne on bylaws? 19:31:02 anyone else? 19:31:05 I suggest to make it more convenient for aclark_ that we impose a Dec. 26 deadline. 19:31:08 * suseROCKs ducks :-) 19:31:14 haha 19:31:37 dec 26 sounds good to me 19:31:38 I'd rather get back to you on a date after I have met with Legal. 19:31:40 * rhorstkoetter hides 19:32:12 I should handle the filing investigation until dec 26th as well 19:32:17 lemme ask... With Legal, is it to have them review what we've written or to seek recommendations from them on what needs to be in the bylaws? 19:32:21 maybe until next meeting 19:32:34 if we are picking deadline, i would suggest 19.12 not 26 :) 19:32:49 prusnak: brave man 19:32:55 prusnak, There is no 19th month. We only have 12 months in a year :-P 19:33:03 I'm supposed to be meeting with them this week. 19:33:30 suseROCKs: export LC_ALL=en_GB.UTF-8 19:33:43 :-) prusnak 19:33:51 suseROCKs: we shouldn't miss a deadline to bring YOU back into rockstar business btw. just for the record :) 19:34:08 ok so let's wait to hear back from aclark_ after his meeting and then on our ML, we'll agree on a timeline when to finish what we need before next steps 19:34:09 bits of both. It is to review the purpose of the foundation - to ensure that we are approaching the bylaws in the right manner 19:35:03 aclark_: so, you'll get in touch with us at board@o.o once you have it settled with novell legal? just to understand that 19:35:05 once I have met with them I'll email ya'll at boar@o.o 19:35:12 great 19:35:28 so I have the action item 19:36:08 aclark_, While its probably way too early to ask... we have seen public statements (via Conference) that Novell is in support of a Foundation. It would be cool if Attachmate could also state such early on. But I guess right now its still too early to ask them such a thing. 19:36:36 To early 19:36:44 #action aclark_ to confer with Legal team this week and reply to board@ with legal advice. After that, board will determine timelines to complete bylaws and other items 19:36:55 aclark_: just wondering, would it be possible for ya to attend our meeting topic about foundation on a regular basis? it seems to me that we get forward faster that way and have an opportunity to discuss open questions in real-time? 19:37:31 scratch the last ? 19:37:44 yes, I have blocked my schedule for this meeting going forward 19:37:57 rhorstkoetter, I think that's also a premature question :-) Soon enough we'll be having new board and that new board will redesignate the meeting times possibly. Can't ask aclark_ for a commitment when we can't guarantee what time the meetings will be yet. 19:38:19 but at least for this month and next month we should be fine with our current schedule 19:38:43 ok I think we can close this topic now 19:39:01 aclark_: thanks for attending and taking the time 19:39:19 #topic openSUSE Board Meeting | Where do we need to improve? 19:40:03 So, I do have a topic on this matter, and wish henne and yaloki were here with their expertise on this matter, but first let's review how things are going with our product in openFATE 19:40:34 we already got some feedback on the news article I posted last week 19:40:38 see https://features.opensuse.org/statistic/product/opensuse.org 19:40:39 * warlordfff really like openFATE 19:41:23 particular interesting (discussed this with henne this morning) is https://features.opensuse.org/310661 19:41:53 IMO we should take care of that one. sounds like a very valid request to me 19:42:06 warlordfff: glad you like it 19:42:07 For reference everyone, our product in openFATE is here: 19:42:08 https://features.opensuse.org/query/run?search_string=&tag=&search_products[]=opensuse.org&search_status[]=unconfirmed&search_status[]=new&search_status[]=marketplace&search_status[]=implementation&search_status[]=done&search_status[]=rejected&search_status[]=duplicate&search_status[]=validation&type=find&commit=Search 19:42:44 well rhorstkoetter before we even get into actual fixes... I think we should review a minute the functionality here 19:42:45 Well make our community even more Democratic 19:43:13 as we stated in the last meeting, our initial concern would be educating people what is proper to put into this list and already I see a few that don't belong in this product list 19:43:52 left untamed, and as this feature becomes more popular to communicate to us with, this will spiral. We should educate from the outset. How do we approach? 19:45:40 suseROCKs: honestly I think this will be quite hard. I outlined very precisely what features/complaints we're interested in and where to file them but still most things show up in news.o.o, aren't valid etc 19:45:46 well we could make a list of things we do with openFATE 19:45:53 I fear we need to live with that 19:45:58 and things we don't 19:46:20 in a wiki page maybe 19:46:23 warlordfff, Well its not openFATE itself, its the product category which is "opensuse.org" within openFATE 19:46:34 ok 19:46:39 let me take a quick moment to explain our goal to warlordfff 19:46:46 ok 19:47:00 We created this new topic here called "Where do we need to improve?" several months ago. 19:47:15 warlordfff: see http://news.opensuse.org/2010/11/23/where-do-we-need-to-improve/ for an explanation 19:47:19 And this is for "immediately fixable" stuff. Not heavy-duty technical stuff. More like... for example, infrastructure. 19:47:41 so that product tag "opensuse.org" serves as a suggestion box to the Board, and what we can do we try to fix it quickly 19:48:30 warlordfff: e.g. https://features.opensuse.org/310661 is a very good example of a valid request 19:48:31 that summarize it well? 19:49:01 what I don't get is what you saw that don't belong in this product list 19:49:02 ? 19:50:14 warlordfff, Well for example earlier today (seems one of us has moved it to another product category) was a request to integrate GIMP with openOffice. 19:50:31 That's not under our purview 19:50:38 oooooh 19:50:40 ok 19:51:16 well as rhorstkoetter we will have to live with that,but... 19:51:20 warlordfff: also at news.o.o comments (anyway the wrong place) there are request not fitting into what I described in the blog post 19:51:43 ok so, rhorstkoetter back to 310661. I agree with the argument stated as well. So... how do we implement? 19:51:55 and openSUSE has google indexing problems elsewhere as well. 19:52:03 suseROCKs: we need to contact bugzilla admins 19:52:12 I'll take for that with henne 19:52:14 I think we need to go higher up 19:52:28 we need to do a complete birds eye overview of our indexability 19:52:37 let me give an example. 19:52:41 yes, but bugzilla isn't indexed at all 19:52:56 I subscribe to google alerts with several important keywords (including my own name hehe) 19:53:15 when I communicate on GNOME infrastructure, I usually see a google alert within minutes 19:53:35 when I communicate on openSUSE, I see a google alert in a few days... IF I'm lucky, but most times, not much 19:53:55 that maybe is due to your name 19:53:57 rofl 19:54:07 not just my name :-P 19:54:24 and my name is pretty unique so it should index pretty quick 19:54:32 I'm just kidding 19:54:53 but you get my point that I have a long-standing belief that we generally aren't following good indexing practices. 19:55:05 I get your point 19:55:16 and thus a top-to-bottom approach needs to be made here rather than piecemeal per item 19:55:18 we certainly can improve SEO 19:55:46 while I second what you said, bugzilla is a special case 19:55:49 * manugupt1 would like to see that :) 19:55:59 robots.txt doesn't allow indexing at all 19:56:02 see which, manugupt1 ? 19:56:20 SEO for openSUSE websites I have asked couple of times at opensuse-web 19:56:42 rhorstkoetter, I wonder if thats an internal policy over at Novell because bugzilla also is used for Novell products 19:57:00 could be yes 19:57:03 which would serve as another argument why we want our own separate non-iChained infrastructure 19:57:06 we need to find out 19:57:30 Even our wiki needs to be optimised better imo 19:57:42 ok so you want to take the action on this, rhorstkoetter? 19:57:43 the user appropraitely oulines that particularly bugzilla is important target for indexing 19:58:12 so is the wiki and so is the forum where many solutions are posted (similarly to posted on bugzilla) 19:58:20 everyone searches error codes in google and you'll always end up in launchpad + find quick workaround in comments of bug reports 19:58:25 not so for suse 19:58:36 that's pretty unfortunate to the user 19:58:49 sure, i know that frustration well. It marginalizes us 19:59:06 suseROCKs: it is. but wiki + forum is indexed, just bad SEO'd 19:59:09 and gives a false indicator to the world that we're going away, which we're not 19:59:15 as far as I can estimate 19:59:44 ok so we have two issues here: 19:59:50 1. bugzilla does not allow indexing 20:00:00 2. Overall openSUSE infrastructure is badly SEO'ed 20:00:10 that sum it up right? 20:00:14 that's it 20:00:32 let's write an email to novell admins to get feedback on 1 20:00:38 1) i'm afraid we can't do anything, but there is a small chance we'll have a separate bugzilla for opensuse eventually 20:00:48 and manugupt1 has expressed his concerns in some groups about SEO. manugupt1 What did you receive as feedback? 20:00:58 + post a request to opensuse-web because of (2) at first glance 20:01:16 suseROCKs, I got they submitted to google analytics but nothing concrete 20:01:26 but we can start it again.. 20:01:37 submitting to google analytics wouldn't boost SEO 20:01:43 manugupt1: would you like to kick that off again 20:01:48 suseROCKs: +1 20:01:55 absolutely useless ;) 20:02:09 atm we are using google analytics, but we'll probably switch to some other solution 20:02:13 I know that.. But yes again I can kick it off.. 20:02:17 quantcast 20:02:26 What we need is a team of SEO experts and I'm not sure we have any around this neck of the woods 20:02:28 prusnak: GA doesn't push SEO at all 20:02:39 i know, i noted that just for the record 20:02:49 We can use keywords from GA 20:02:55 as metatags 20:03:09 * rhorstkoetter looks at manugupt1 20:03:20 okay, but this discussion is getting offtopic 20:03:22 suseROCKs: you see our SEO expert next to us? 20:03:24 ;) 20:03:30 careful, manugupt1. rhorstkoetter gets easily infatuated :-) 20:03:35 please discuss this issue further on opensuse-web@ 20:03:52 Ok.. 20:04:09 prusnak, sure it should be discussed in the proper forum. What I wanted to get from manugupt1 was whether there was sufficient feedback on it when he talked about it before 20:04:17 whether people agreed or pushed back on it. 20:04:59 suseROCKs: fortunately 20:05:51 to get back on topic, I'll get in touch with henne what to do with bugzilla indexing 20:06:28 manugupt1: we'd appreciate if you'd again try to kick off SEO discussion at opensuse-web ml 20:06:31 ok? 20:06:53 Fine with me 20:07:03 manugupt1: thx, apprciated 20:07:10 manugupt1, and please let us know if there is good positive response to the issue. If not, then we will look at how to escalate it 20:07:13 (and that's our fix!) 20:07:24 Ok.. 20:07:50 #action rhorstkoetter and henne to discuss how to make bugzilla indexing better and reach out to Novell admins on this matter 20:08:19 #action manugupt1 to communicate with opensuse-web@ on how to improve openSUSE infrastructure SEO and report back to us his findings. 20:09:18 prusnak: one more remark on GA 20:09:26 have you had a look at piwik? 20:09:30 ok I have a new topic under this topic but I fear you all will have to bear with me and my technical ignorance on this matter 20:09:44 rhorstkoetter, I use piwik. It's pretty rad in some ways and pretty sucky in a lot of ways 20:09:47 would be, from my perspective, a welcome FLOSS alternative to GA 20:09:53 rhorstkoetter: henne is investigating it, piwik is one of the options 20:10:00 and piwik development in my opinion isn't very reliable 20:10:01 and probably the best one 20:10:01 prusnak: IC 20:10:09 but I do know GNOME uses piwik 20:10:18 suseROCKs: I use it + like it 20:10:45 I use it in conjunction with GA 20:10:54 anyway... not for us to squabble about here 20:11:01 +1 20:11:08 we trust the implementers to make the best judgment 20:11:12 anything else on that topic? 20:11:18 suseROCKs: definitely 20:11:20 none from me, so I have a new one 20:11:55 the issue is in reqards to how to make proper packaging requests 20:12:27 yaloki, and I talked about this yesterday and we were of the feeling that it wasn't very clear in our openSUSE Project how someone can request a package to be added 20:12:40 openFATE? 20:12:53 haven't done that personally 20:13:01 this can be a barrier, as I encountered yesterday, where a developer decides to use openSUSE as their development platform but only gets frustrated because packages he/she relies on are more available on other distros 20:13:18 and that person switched back to the other distro 20:13:41 and this will be a problem if our current strategy proposal goes to appeal to a broader developer community to come to openSUSE 20:14:33 rhorstkoetter, I don't know if openFATE is the way to go 20:14:37 I don't think os 20:14:38 so 20:14:57 there's some confusion also about whether to send the email to packaging@ or to buildservice@ and both are subscription mailing lists 20:15:01 suseROCKs: so, I clearly see where you're coming from. what do you propose? 20:15:01 which further creates burden 20:15:36 I mean in order to improve the process and make it clearer to developers/requesters? 20:15:43 rhorstkoetter, i'm not sure what to propose, other than a simple dropbox where people can say "I want this package" somewhere. I was hopign both henne and yaloki would be here so we could properly explore as I don't package :-( 20:16:15 everything in openSUSE now requires subscribing or logging in (iChain) and that's an additional barrier 20:16:32 suseROCKs: yes, I also think we need both yaloki + henne here. let's kick off a discussion about it at board@o.o 20:17:55 we probably have to do that. unless prusnak can add some insights here? 20:19:10 Folks! hang in there, we're about to enter the Question & Answer period... just as soon as we finish this topic! 20:19:22 insights to what ? 20:19:46 prusnak: to the topic we're talking about :P 20:19:48 if you want a package then just package it 20:19:54 the matter of unclear procedure for requesting packages + the barriers that inhibit ease of request without going through "red tape" so to speak 20:20:07 prusnak: we talk about requesting packages 20:20:22 not packaging them 20:20:28 yes 20:20:33 but noone is going to do the package for you 20:20:52 we have had package wishlist for ages, it doesn't work that way 20:21:00 somewhere there's instructions to send the request to packaging@ but you have to subscribe to the list in order to do that 20:21:14 prusnak: then we urgently need to improve here 20:21:16 prusnak, why did it fail? 20:21:22 (at least not now when we are struggling with manpower) 20:21:36 the solution cannot be to just accept the current status quo 20:21:38 IMO 20:22:03 providing a false expectation is not a solution 20:22:29 its not a question of status quo in my opinion, but how we look when we publicly implement our strategy and it implies a welcome environment for developers 20:22:31 there might be someone who has time, but in 99% cases it does not work unfortunately 20:22:43 and those who package only do care about their stuff 20:22:59 the "false expectation" is precisely the issue here 20:23:34 one thing I have said many times over the years is we *need* to educate more people on how to package 20:23:55 We have a knowledge gap here, that's for sure, and we can't close the manpower issue if we maintain the knowledge gap 20:24:22 we cannot remain a community totally dependent on Novell's resources. That's unfair to Novell 20:24:45 and to us ;-) 20:24:58 ( a couple of real-world, written-in-noob-english, cradle-to-grave examples of OBS building would go a long way to that education ) 20:25:37 dev001, What I keep hearing (and I'm not a techie) is if you don't know how to write spec files, OBS isn't going to get you very far 20:25:54 hence, my suggestion ... 20:26:35 so rhorstkoetter you still there? 20:26:43 suseROCKs: certainly 20:26:55 I wait for dev001's suggestion 20:26:56 to me seems the solution here is a) first build up stronger education on OBS packaging 20:27:06 and then b) have more people available to respond to wishlist 20:27:10 rhorstkoetter: look up ... 20:27:21 this all boils down to SUSE sucks in documenting things 20:27:31 this was and still is a big issue 20:27:42 dev001: I second your suggestion. we need manpower to do this 20:27:48 documenting / educating -- tomato / to-mah-toe :-) 20:27:58 tomatensalat 20:28:03 * rhorstkoetter likes that 20:28:16 That's not even a real word. It's German! 20:28:17 * suseROCKs ducks 20:29:06 dev001: I fear that if such documentation isn't written in community effort it won't be there in a foreseenable future 20:29:17 rhorstkoetter: re: manpower, agreed. new users would be more likely to (i) learn, (i) start write-ups & contribution if we didn't treat them ... less than spectacularly. 20:29:22 suseROCKs: I'm German by nature 20:29:23 ok so we're not at an actual solution. Even dev001's great suggestion isn't a solution yet unless we actually have someone to do it 20:29:52 I believe we need to develop a kind of special universities/academy program to help OBS culture to reach students in the early phase of their graduations. 20:30:55 CarlosRibeiro: again manpower. don't get me wrong, these are brilliant suggestions and I feel just the same. question for me is "who stands up and actually does it + is able to do it" 20:30:58 IMO our problem is most related with culture than skills on how to package things 20:31:01 suseROCKs: one other issue is domain (sort of) experts like me who use OBS, is it also woefully behind the docs curve 20:31:28 I agree with rhorstkoetter man power and to write a simple doc it takes a lot of time 20:31:45 even for someone like me who uses it daily is sometimes lost... it is changing/maturing/more featurefull quickly 20:31:48 mrdocs is behind the docs curve? :-) 20:31:53 (couldn't resist) 20:31:56 obs is one of the most powerful tools we have, it's a unique advantage that differentiates us from *every* other distro, it's a great way to attract/retain users/contributors, once used, it benefits the ENTIER community -- and we wholly underutilize it, hiding behind "expertise". 20:31:59 * mrdocs nods and grins 20:32:24 so where do we get people to document OBS and packaging? 20:32:45 prusnak: i've volunteered to do some this month 20:32:46 or how do we motivate existing members of our community to do so ? 20:32:49 I say first, focus on documenting. Then afterward we can focus on packaging 20:32:54 yes 20:32:58 suseROCKs: what we may try (and may fail) is get in touch with OBS people at opensuse-buildservice, explain the urgent issue, the consequences by not providing sufficient docs and the opportunities we have by providing docs 20:33:01 so maybe for now, we put a call out to have a OBS Documentation Collaboration Day? 20:33:04 τηε Γρεεκ ψομμθνιτυ ψαν τακε α παρτ οφ ιτ 20:33:12 sorry 20:33:22 rhorstkoetter: OBS team will not document anything 20:33:28 they have lots of other stuff on their plate 20:33:32 rhorstkoetter, That's not something those folks haven't heard already. As prusnak pointed out, its a resource issue for them 20:33:34 prusnak: exactly 20:33:42 that's the only thing I can think of currently. then hope for a altruistic soul helping out 20:33:50 the Greek community can take a part of documenting OBS 20:34:12 I have a couple of people who are interesting in it 20:34:18 so? Should we call out for a OBS Documentation Collaboration Day (or week or?) ? 20:34:28 folks, it's a hen and egg problem 20:35:01 no it isn't 20:35:03 I beleive after I talk with Ricardo that is owner of one important University in Brazil, we will be able to get some students from that university to give us a hand on OBS documentations too. 20:35:04 suseROCKs: i like your idea 20:35:05 warlordfff: and a couple of people knowledged to write docs for interested parties 20:35:07 ? 20:35:18 Documentation first! then let the rest of the chips fall where they may 20:35:36 suseROCKs: b4 calling "a Day", i suggest pick ONE example. say a server pkg, like Apache httpd. something big-ish, and familiar. do a complete example 'series' -- build native & opensuse-derived, @ obs-client & @ obs-web. 20:35:41 yes i believe so they are programmers,I'll contact them 20:35:55 but with whom I contact then? 20:35:58 document ONT thing 1st. do it really well. BEFORE rinse-n-repeat .... 20:36:24 give me an e-mail to give them 20:36:53 and talk about it 20:36:54 CarlosRibeiro, ok so when we have this collaboration period, please do welcome them to participate 20:37:07 but before that, now we need a volunteer to comandeer this Collaboration process 20:37:21 take a quick breeze to summarize please 20:37:24 aligned? 20:37:35 1. collaboration Day 20:37:47 or week or month, depends. 20:37:51 suseROCKs: any detailed explanation? 20:38:07 just raw details 20:38:21 Someone with a reasonable level of expertise in OBS should lead this project. and determine the timeline of the collaboration 20:38:37 obviously it can't be me cuz I don't know all the puzzle pieces :-) 20:38:44 same here 20:38:44 rhorstkoetter can you give me an e-mail to give the people from the Greek community to contact for further information about writing Documentation about OBS? 20:39:05 warlordfff: I'll get to that in a few 20:39:08 ok 20:39:09 mrdocs, dev001 Interested in taking the lead on this? 20:39:54 this is the moment of typical silence :-D 20:40:08 suseROCKs: I have zero success in using OBS to build a single thing. i have no obs-fu, apparently. i build what i need from native source -- far simpler. 20:40:12 * prusnak has to go now 20:40:15 o/ 20:40:25 ok prusnak thanks man! 20:40:31 prusnak: thx for attending 20:40:40 then it looks like mrdocs is going to be our victim! ;-) 20:40:52 looks like 20:40:55 good opportunity for you to strut your stuff mrdocs if you're running for board 20:41:13 i'd volunteer darix, as he seems to speak in obs-tongues, at times, but he gets typically grumpy when you volunteer 'im for stuff ;-) 20:41:30 dev001: no darix is too busy/important 20:41:38 darix is an extremely taxed man with his time. I'd feel bad asking him to lead a big thing like this 20:41:46 and I am a native English speaker/writer 20:41:51 so sign me up 20:41:59 We have a volunteer!!! 20:42:16 #action mrdocs to organize collaboration efforts to document OBS 20:42:24 suseROCKs: i was going to work on it this month anyways.. long a promise to Adrian 20:42:30 warlordfff: did I get you right that you may encourage parts of the greek community to write docs on their own? 20:42:35 but extra help is welcome 20:42:38 and 20:42:50 rhorstkoetter yes 20:42:58 warlordfff: IRC is far more important for OBS than the mail list FYI 20:42:59